CAS from armed Caravans?

[Bruce Gorrell]

I didn’t realize how much the Stinger was used in Afghanistan.
This gives perspective.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wobG_6...ature=youtu.be

We were selling Stingers to the Afghans back when they were fighting the Russians.

[Russell Holton]

The latest generation of shoulder fired missiles only needs a reflection off the windshield and it's got-cha.

Who builds them? "Us" or "them"?

I see there are models that are laser guided or even remotely guided, but they seem to require a lot of training and are built by "us" so we're not as likely to come up against them. The soviet stuff seemed to be IR. But that was on a very quick read. I could be overlooking something.

[Bill Bridges]

The latest generation of shoulder fired missiles only needs a reflection off the windshield and it's got-cha.

[Dave Siciliano]

Caravan is highly dependable, has a good useful load and can loiter for a long time. I don’t know what they’re fitting the with for military ops, but I would thing connectivity for coordination and sensors along with weaponry.

[Russell Holton]

I think this is more for CAS in smaller, localized actions where more immediate response is needed for smaller targets. That’s how Army armed helos started. As actions got bigger, against conventional forces, different platforms made more sense.

Conversely, the platforms used successfully in the bigger actions may not be the best tool when a new conflict arises and you're back in a smaller action. As my friend likes to say, "the right tool for the right job." What works against an organized military may not work against smaller groups.

[Dave Siciliano]

I didn’t realize how much the Stinger was used in Afghanistan.
This gives perspective.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wobG_68P_LE&feature=youtu.be

[Dave Siciliano]

I think this is more for CAS in smaller, localized actions where more immediate response is needed for smaller targets. That’s how Army armed helos started. As actions got bigger, against conventional forces, different platforms made more sense.

[Terry Carraway]

Why not a Caravan?

O-2s (Cessna Skymaster) have been used in low threat arenas.

Not a 30 mm, but gun pods with either an M60 or Minigun. Both of them fire the 7.62x51 NATO round.

Also rocket pods.

We can talk in Duluth.

[Russell Holton]

Oops, saw Cessna and thought "piston"...yeah, it should handle that.

And I was thinking of Randy's comments about how turbine was so much better for operations. So I did a quick check.

[Ralph Jones]

IR signature of a turbo prop.

Oops, saw Cessna and thought "piston"...yeah, it should handle that.

[Dave Siciliano]

Ralph: this seems to address than on page 15.

https://media.defense.gov/2019/Apr/11/2002115503/-1/-1/0/37MANPADS.PDF

[Russell Holton]

Hmm...wonder how MANPADs do against piston aircraft.

Good question. Looking at the Wiki article on the MANPADs, it appears that the most likely ones they've have access to are the infrared homing type. But I have no clue if it could lock into the IR signature of a turbo prop.

[Ralph Jones]

Just hope one of them doesn't have a missile.

Hmm...wonder how MANPADs do against piston aircraft.

[Russell Holton]

Well, maybe you don't need an A-10 size gun against the kind of armor you'd see in a Third World environment

Like a bunch of guys in the back of a Toyota pickup? Just hope one of them doesn't have a missile.

I'm suspecting the desire here is being able to fire without having to wait for help. By the time help arrives, the targets will have spotted the spotter and made themselves scarce. Having some firepower now may be better than superior firepower later.

[Ralph Jones]

Well, maybe you don't need an A-10 size gun against the kind of armor you'd see in a Third World environment -- but yes, if insertion/extraction is in the mix, I don't see why a helo wouldn't be better.